Your take on the St Louis Transworld Show 2009

[SpookywoodsFX.com]

I don't care as much where it is but rather who attends. Larry, what do you mean "we have our own show"? Transworld isn't the only show, is it?

As a vendor, I would rather have a show for buyers. Buyers make the show. Wait... Vendors make the show!
Hhmmmm... One without the other??
The bigger the show, the more buyers will attend....
The bigger the show, the more vendors will attend...
Can you argue with either?

Vegas, a bust? Too expensive, sure. But how did the vendors do in '08? Did the buyers have a good time outside the show? Creepy place, in my opinion, but the show was my concern, not the night life. We sold to allot of "big names" that did not make the St. Louis show. Why didn't they make it to the St. Louise show, Larry? That retail side brought in ALLOT of buyers (read, buyers), as did the haunt side. As a vendor I want MORE buyers there, not less. There were less buyers in St. Louis. I want the buyer to see things that they weren't expecting to see (from the haunt side) and make those spontaneous purchases.
In Chicago, a couple years ago, I had a blast. I wasn't a vendor but I had a great time looking at EVERYTHING, not just the haunt side. It's great to see ALL the new things on display. I know that there are vendors and buyers alike that sit on either side of the fence but what does it hurt? What's the problem with both at a show? Parking?
I would imagine that it may be difficult, or not within budget for a company (or for whatever reason), to send these buyers to more than one or two shows a year. As a buyer, which one to go to? Depends on your needs but how do you know you 'need' something if you don't know it exists? Wal-Mart or Target? Both have similar products but I get my prescriptions filled at Wal-Mart, so that's where I go. Target loses my my business on groceries, general products and some clothing needs. It's great for ME, as a buyer, to have more options but Target loses my business because I'm not going to drive to both.
Transworld did the haunt side dirty this year with the set-up they had and advertising they did at and for the Vegas show.

[mindtumor]

Can we just combine it with Wizard World and a powerlifting competition? That way I can buy haunt products, do a comic convention, and compete all on one trip. That is what is in my best interest.

[Mr Nightmarez]

Or just take it to California and coincide with Comicon?
Or Megacon in Orlando?
Or Fangoria Weekend....

I think the key is - It's not about us vs them - It's an entire industry - like it or not - the retail side and haunters side will crossover.
Where are the buyers and where can the vendors go to actually compensate and get actual buyers? The cost that vendors take and endure to get the products to buyers needs to be equaled by the number of buyers so they can actually offset the cost per show. (Of course - since they want to stay in business!)

A lot of valid points and things to ponder. Sadly the vendors need to be the driving force. As I will have to attend in order to buy - but vendors don't have to show... Regardless of the debate - if I were a vendor I would have to make the call on where am I getting the most BANG for my buck.

Witht the number of shows: MHC, NHC, Hauntcon, TW, Fangoria, Etc - not to mention smaller or other cons... I can only imagine how tough it is for the vendors to figure out where they need to be vs where they want to be and where they wish they could be...

[MDKing]

The better vendors can make all the difference where we all go! If top vendors say we're going to convention X and thats their only convention they are showing at, then thats where most people will go!

Allan

[Mr Nightmarez]

The better vendors can make all the difference where we all go! If top vendors say we're going to convention X and thats their only convention they are showing at, then thats where most people will go!

Allan

"
EXACTLY! As they say "Build it and they will come" Well it worked for Filed of Dreams
So if the Vendors show support for XXX Show - the haunter's will follow.

[Ken Spriggs]

Well now

Ron........Hell of a man for standing your ground!
Larry.....Quit ripping on people for their opinion.....he is making you money by even showing up on this message board. You made money off him at the Darkness and he probably subscribes to Hauntworld......be nice to people!

We need to stand behind shows......I will see how MHC goes this weekend before I say anything more on the subject.

NOW WE ALL KNOW THAT I REALLLLLLLLYYYYYYYYY WANT THE SHOW BACK IN CHICAGO!!!!
Yep....admission for DR just went to an arm and a leg......need new props!!!! lol

CORY?.....nice!

[Ken Spriggs]

Ohhhh

Ohhh and TODD????
I am with you on that XXX SHOW !!!!!

Costumes will be alot easier for that crowd!!!!

[graystone]

Hey guys!

Hell I got plenty of room we got like 200,000sqft yall come to BAMA! Booths will be free!!!!!! Shane and its call now to reserve your booth space! Shane this time!!

[drfrightner]

Ken,

I am NOT ripping on ANYONE for their opinion. You post yours, he'll post his, and I'll post mine. Fact is if someone is going to make a statement that I have some information that shows it to be false I will let people know what I know.

I have spoken to MANY vendors and some did awesome and some did great, and some did okay, and some didn't do as good as last year. Its all over the board but overall costs went down, profits went up for most vendors. Some simply got more leads than they ever imagined but didn't turn them into sales at the show.

Bottom line however is the shows are NOT going to combine so talking about it rather than working on making what we have better is a waste of time. People should learn to get on the same page, work together and see some positive results, rather than always twisting in five different directions.

That is my opinion and that isn't ripping on anyone. Lastly, just because someone bought my magazine, or bought a banner ad, doesn't mean I should not state my opinion because I will I always will just like you do. Hey I bought your scents and it doesn't keep your mouth from spitting out your opinions pro or con for me against me... so take your own advice.

You have an opinion, I have one, and so does several others.

I can live with the fact that not everyone can agree, however sometimes we need to come together just a bit more!

Larry

PS: I don't make five cents from people visiting this message board not even two cents. So lets keep the facts straight. If the message board went awol it wouldn't have any impact on my bank account you can rest better tonight knowing that! LOL

[drfrightner]

Spookywoods FX...

"We now have our own show" ... you asked a question let me respond.

No we don't own the show however there is a board of haunt vendors who more or less pushed everything in the direction and affected the outcome of how most everything was done, marketed, and more. In addition this same board is working with TW right now to keep the costs low for vendors, showing them how to go after additional buyers, and fixing the show to make it better for both buyers and vendors.

Secondly, considering its a Halloween Attraction show, and you as a haunt vendors, and others as haunt owners its a SHOW FOR YOURS and everyone elses business.

So yeah I call it our own show.

I wouldn't call a show dominated by retail associations, retail vendors, and retail buyer groups OUR SHOW would you?

As for the other shows, they are all fine and dandy but we all know the show that means the most to your business is this Transworld haunt show, it draws the most buyers, the most vendors, and the most orders are writen. Its important to all vendors and buyers.

That is NOT to say IAAPA isn't important or that MHC or Hauntcon isn't important no no no but putting things in proper perspective this is how most vendors feed their families, means the most to their survival and now that the show focuses on YOUR BUSINESS rather than Rubies you should be happy as a peach!

Larry

[Grimley]

You keep saying the shows won't get back together. Lately it seems things change from day to day with these things. If we continue to push for them to get back together they eventually will. Call your Transworld rep today. 1 show.

[drfrightner]

Grim... do yourself a favor and go back to those threads on the Vegas show and take a deep hard look at them. How many vendors do you think are going back for round two on that one? You tell me.

See some of you seem to forget that this is a business, its not all fun and games. It costs THOUSANDS of dollars to go to these shows, THOUSANDS! A rubies for example I've heard spend as much as half a million going to a show. How many times do you think they want to spend that much money? You tell me?

Look we all need to face it... Houston is taking over, they are the new Haloween retail show. They have the evil empire on their side... LOL.

Our vendors can't afford $2500.00 a booth or putting our chips into a show that isn't much better than the Vegas/Chicago show, and further to that Houston doesn't have any clue how to promote to haunters and wouldn't because Rubies runs the show for the most part.

Its better to have the focus on haunts, and if retail vendors want to come they will... lastly nothing against the haunted fans, but if you polled HAUNT OWNERS ONLY you'll find over 85% of them doesn't want to go back with those retail vendors.

I was just talking to a friend in Tennessee who owns a haunt who said to me like so many others... HE WAS TIRED OF RETAILERS telling him 'WE WONT SELL TO YOU". They make you feel like you are worthless.

The last year in Vegas I almost knocked out a retailer who told me 'we won't sell to your kind'.... I'm like what am I a mutant? I was pissed ... he then said something to me that set me off and then we got into a pissing match. I was pissed.

I went straight to Scott Morris and told him about it...

That wasn't the first time it happened. Bottom line is if you are a Halloween fan, yard haunter or whatever YES you want to see the shows combined but as a haunt owner I want to see stuff strickly for attractions and lastly only want to spend my time dealing with companies that want to sell to me.

Last but not least I'll put 10 to 1 on it that you'll see two or three times more retail vendors at the show next year. They'll be there or at least the ones that actually want to sell to haunters.

Larry

[Grimley]

Larry,

First I find it very VERY hard to believe any vendor would tell anyone they won't sell to them. Especially the way the economy is going. I can understand that you don't meet the minimum order quantity but telling someone they can't buy is bull...t. Sorry I'm gonna have to ask you which company that was because I don't believe it. And don't give me this I don't wanna say who it was because you have no reason to protect such a deadbeat. NO REASON. So who was it.

Secondly yes it does cost vendors thousands of dollars to go to these shows but as buyers we spend thousands to go as well. Especially when the shows are split up. 6 airline ticket and four hotel rooms is not cheap. Hell we may spend more than some of the vendors now that the shows are split. It was way to easy when the shows were together to see everyone and buy what we needed.

And Third if the vendors are paying $1500 for a booth at the haunt show and see 2000 buyers versus paying $2500 for the big show and seeing 8000 buyers I think they are getting a deal. They would be seeing at least twice the number of qualified buyers at the big show. Be realistic for a second. I don't know about you but I met a lot of home haunters at the show taking a lot of pictures and doing nothing else. Great people but not buyers. So for less money you get more exposure. And the vendors may just meet people like us that cross over and make nice orders. Orders we may never have placed had we not attended both shows.

There I'm done.

[drfrightner]

No offense but sometimes I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall... considering the shows are NOT going back together I don't know why I even bother to explain this but one more time.

Can I ask you do you own a haunted house? That has a lot to do with this really. Secondly, yes I was told and yes many haunters where told many many times YOU CAN NOT BUY FROM US. You know this is nothing new why don't you go to IAAPA and try to buy say an air hockey game. YOU CANT... why because they won't sell you just one and they have distributors. You have to deal with them and pay the higher price. Again nothing new you could go to all sorts of tradeshows and unless you have the proper type of store they won't sell to you to protect their real buyers.

The retailers tried to get the hauntes booted about six years ago... where you around for that or did you come along since? Yeah that happened too... how do you explain that one? Why do you think this whole Houston thing got started, well not all because of haunters but that is one of the big reasons. It would take me 30 minutes of typing to explain it all but yep we are not wanted so why would you want to be somewhere where you are not wanted. Transworld also got pushed into this seperate badges for haunters so retailers COULD PICK YOU OUT SO THEY KNEW... NOPE don't want to deal with you!

I don't think you understand the history to make the proper statements you have made because I'm telling you what I'm saying is right. Either way and lastly you said put everything together so people can buy what they need... LOL LOL LOL!

I really laugh at that one because I've said it before ... lets see Rubies sells Batman and Robin, they sell Star Wars costumes, and well there are pumpkin carving kits, there are cheap 10 dollar masks, there is hmmm yard decor, cheap tombstones, plastic weapons, wigs, all sorts of silly adult costumes, and tons and tons of sexy cloths and a lot more.

If you own a haunt why do you need any of that non-sense? Do retailers need giant animations? Do retailers need $600 props or $40 made in mexico or china props? Do haunters want $40 dollar made in mexico props, or $6000 Scarefactory animations?

You tell me. Bottom line is there are a few a very few retailers that might want something and they know where it all is just like Spirits who came to ST LOUIS TRANSWORLD!

There are Halloween retail vendors who know where we are and they are more than welcome to come and exhibit in 2010 and guess what THEY WILL YOU'LL SEE... but the vendor that sells Batman costumes still won't be there and we don't need them anyway!

Its fun to look at and you know what I'll be at my local SPIRITS STORE LOOKING IN OCTOBER! That way I didn't have to go but down the street! LOL

Larry

[drfrightner]

Now back to the real subject at hand and no one can dispute this...

1) Houston Halloween Retail show: Many thought sales where light, traffic was light, and people thought because the traffic didn't show up many people would be going to Vegas. The early word was Houston would dismantle Transworld, all vendors went to Houston and someone took a wait and see for Vegas. After this show looked like a BOMB everyone started booking booths in Vegas thinking 'oh yeah I guess everyone is sticking with Transworld'.

2) Transworld Vegas: Transworlds spirits went high as a kite after Houston results came in. Transworld poured more into advertising this show than any show before. I think everyone thought this show was going to rock because of the let down in Houston. NOPE... this one was a bigger bomb than Houston. Some people say fewer than 500 attended a show that once drew in nearly 10,000. Hardly any vendors, almost no buyers the show is being moved back to Chicago in hopes to salvage it.

3) Haunt Show St. Louis: Many thought it woud bomb after what happened in Houston and Vegas and because many thought haunts was too small to have its own show. Results: OVER FIVE THOUSAND PEOPLE ATTENDED including tons of Halloween retail vendors to walk the show, including tons of retail buyers.

END RESULT: It is clear Chicago and Houston retail shows can't survive with both still going and the vendors and the buyers know this. Now with Transworld moving their show back to Chicago in an even colder month than before and both shows in the Midwest so to speak, and because the shows are nearly right on top of each other, one of these shows is headed for a TOTAL AND UTTER MELTDOWN! 2010 will be the last year for one of these shows...take your pick. Rubies in one corner and Transworld in the other.

Haunt Show thrived out from under the shell and influence of retailers. Now that haunts are free and clear all marketing dollars spent are spent to promote haunts and attractions ONLY and attendance and number of vendors thrived!

BOTTOM LINE: Haunt show will go on without retail but add even more attraction related vendors and even more retail vendors for 2010 and beyond. Retail shows will continue to slide to the point maybe both will go under because most Halloween retail vendors are now down to a handfull of companies and don't need tradeshows to place orders.

To be straight to the original question there is my assessment.

Larry